Hal I really enjoyed this piece, and although I agree whole heartedly with idea of ‘emergence’, I’d like to add that I don’t think ‘it’s just us’. Perhaps in terms of summarizing that debate, it represents well the conclusion. But I also thought in response to it, if we continue to think biologically, in a system where we animals eat animals and plants, our survival is contingent on the mutual flourishing of the whole tree of life. I think when we look outside the west we see systems of morality that go beyond the anthropocentric and are able to extend their responsibilities, to Land and Spirits. I think that Jung starts to see this necessity when the ‘contents’ of his subconscious tell him they are as real as he(red book). I think this makes things much harder than a merely anthropological morality, but maybe also simpler... What are the values that emerge out of the preferences of being, when the eternal is without quality? Asking that reminds me that in a Christian cosmology, commandements were handed ‘down’.
Yeah, I was having trouble with the ending. By "us" I meant life in general even if humans are the only ones who can articulate it.
I think the 'contents' insisted that they were as real as him but that Jung's position ends up being that they are real in a different way. He says elsewhere that dream contents are real because they effect reality. When he meets the god Izdubar Jung gets him to admit that he is only as real as a myth is real.
I'm open to the spiritual and mystical things that come up with Jung but I'd need to think about it before saying more.
As far as the values that emerge it seems like survival and to keep evolution going toward whatever we're moving toward. This has an 'up' feeling to me. But could you say more about the last two sentences? I'm not sure I understand all of it.
Hal I really enjoyed this piece, and although I agree whole heartedly with idea of ‘emergence’, I’d like to add that I don’t think ‘it’s just us’. Perhaps in terms of summarizing that debate, it represents well the conclusion. But I also thought in response to it, if we continue to think biologically, in a system where we animals eat animals and plants, our survival is contingent on the mutual flourishing of the whole tree of life. I think when we look outside the west we see systems of morality that go beyond the anthropocentric and are able to extend their responsibilities, to Land and Spirits. I think that Jung starts to see this necessity when the ‘contents’ of his subconscious tell him they are as real as he(red book). I think this makes things much harder than a merely anthropological morality, but maybe also simpler... What are the values that emerge out of the preferences of being, when the eternal is without quality? Asking that reminds me that in a Christian cosmology, commandements were handed ‘down’.
Thanks Sam!
Yeah, I was having trouble with the ending. By "us" I meant life in general even if humans are the only ones who can articulate it.
I think the 'contents' insisted that they were as real as him but that Jung's position ends up being that they are real in a different way. He says elsewhere that dream contents are real because they effect reality. When he meets the god Izdubar Jung gets him to admit that he is only as real as a myth is real.
I'm open to the spiritual and mystical things that come up with Jung but I'd need to think about it before saying more.
As far as the values that emerge it seems like survival and to keep evolution going toward whatever we're moving toward. This has an 'up' feeling to me. But could you say more about the last two sentences? I'm not sure I understand all of it.